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5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Discussion of forensic issues related to all types of mobile phones and underlying technologies (GSM, GPRS, UMTS/3G, HSDPA, LTE, Bluetooth etc.)
Subforums: Mobile Telephone Case Law
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TinyBrain
Senior Member
 

5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 25, 19 01:21

What is the preferred 5G method for Cell Site Analysis in your Police corps? Do you also use a simulation suite (e.g. Remcom) and 3D-GIS-Modelling including weather and air humidity parameters (permittivity) to simulate sub-meter positioning and direction of movement?

Which Police corps (except Israeli Police) runs 5G CSA live positioning?  
 
  

TinyBrain
Senior Member
 

Re: 5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 28, 19 04:22

5G mobiles will have inertial measurement (e.g. CAT). Combined with 3D-City-Maps 5G brings new accuracy of postioning in Dual Connectivity mode. Who runs tests about 5G positioning and VoWiFi CDR geomovements logging?  
 
  

trewmte
Senior Member
 

Re: 5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 28, 19 08:36

A situation of interest is when a signal can be produced due to physical movement or orientation variation of a mobile target, including but not limited to acceleration, speed, heading angle, and turning rate. Inertial sensors (such as accelerators and gyroscopes) and magnetometers are usually used to measure these parameters. Typically, in modern implementation these accelerators and gyroscopes are integrated into a small solid-state sensor packages, which collectively is termed an inertial measurement unit (IMU). An IMU, or a group of IMUs in some cases, is an essential part of an inertial navigation system (INS). Due to the great advances in microelectromechanical system (MEMS), modern INS equipment can be manufactured using a tiny chip which can be easily embedded into small devices such as mobile phones. The principle of such an INS is that integration of the acceleration produces a velocity and a further integration provides a position estimate. Angular data from integrating the gyroscope data are also required, as the accelerometer measurements include the acceleration due to the Earth’s gravity, so that angular information is required for correct interpretation of the accelerometer data. Such integration processes only provide relative movement, and also small sensor measurement offsets result in a slow drift in position, even when stationary. Thus an INS is rarely used independently, but is integrated with another positioning technology.

Helpful image https://www.dropbox.com/s/asztlgqce7uby2v/IMU%20MEMS.png?

Helpful outline where 5G is launched or intends to be launched - https://www.lifewire.com/5g-availability-world-4156244
_________________
Institute for Digital Forensics (IDF) - www.linkedin.com/groups/2436720
Mobile Telephone Examination Board (MTEB) - www.linkedin.com/groups/141739
Universal Network Investigations - www.linkedin.com/groups/13536130
Mobile Telephone Evidence & Forensics trewmte.blogspot.com 
 
  

hcso1510
Senior Member
 

Re: 5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 28, 19 15:44

- TinyBrain


Which Police corps (except Israeli Police) runs 5G CSA live positioning?



TB,
I was thinking if you are asking this sort of question that you are probably law enforcement yourself? Why don't you try logging into your Interpol forum account and querying the other law enforcement agencies. I can only imagine the number of law enforcement agencies from around the globe that would be willing to assist with your inquiry. Please let us know what you find out.

Cheers!
_________________
Ed

I'm not a cellular technology expert, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. 
 
  

TinyBrain
Senior Member
 

Re: 5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 28, 19 16:29

The ciphering - mainly key exchanges in 5G is on my table. Currently studying 33.501 v15.4.0 (2019-03) Kseaf as step 12. on Figure 6.1.3.2-1 during authentiation. As I got told that in EN-DC 5GNR mixed positioning on LTE and 5G NR (3,7GHz) is possible different positioning protocols cross each other. I actually dont understand the positioning. The only thing I have is the Viavi 'Lighting the Path to 5G' poster and there studying the '5G Architecture Options' Option 7/7a/7x which is NSA with Multi Connectivity.

I first need the understand the physical/logical layers and then I can dive into the key exchange.

So I just ask - simple.  
 
  

trewmte
Senior Member
 

Re: 5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 28, 19 17:34

- TinyBrain
The only thing I have is the Viavi 'Lighting the Path to 5G' poster and there studying the '5G Architecture Options' Option 7/7a/7x which is NSA with Multi Connectivity.

I first need the understand the physical/logical layers and then I can dive into the key exchange.


I have that poster. It actually identifies the 3GPP NR standards to follow under 'Radio Protocols, Management & Procedures Specifications.'
_________________
Institute for Digital Forensics (IDF) - www.linkedin.com/groups/2436720
Mobile Telephone Examination Board (MTEB) - www.linkedin.com/groups/141739
Universal Network Investigations - www.linkedin.com/groups/13536130
Mobile Telephone Evidence & Forensics trewmte.blogspot.com 
 
  

TinyBrain
Senior Member
 

Re: 5G Cell Site Analysis (Positioning)

Post Posted: Mar 29, 19 03:15

Your dropbox pic is helpful too, thanks. Lets co-reference together from the poster. The Option 7/7a/7x mentions the 4G ng-eNB as master and the 5G SgNB as slave so multi connected. Both connected to the same 5G core. Does the 5G core coordinate the positioning? If yes, by which same positioning protocol (standard required to follow you, please)?  
 

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